On the Road 1 shot filtration
August 17, 2011 - 10:16pm
thanks for taking your time to read and help.
We are looking to make or get a 1 shot filtration unit for our Truck & Camper for when we are on the road like right now we are planning to be on the road for about 2 months so we will need a lot of WVO.
So far we are using a small 10GPM 12V Pump with a pre-screen and a 10 micron fuel filter with water separator and and so far so good.
The major frustrations are :
1) the slow flow rate.....specially when the tank is empty and we get to a place that their holding tanks are overflowing and because of the 20mins cycle we can fill the tank!!!
2) changing to many filters its getting pricy since is normally 2 filters per tank (I guess because of the water factor)
3) limited space since the truck is a single cab and we have the full size camper on the back.
We kind of like the 1 shot unit from GFS since we like the Racor filtration system but WE ARE NOT SPENDING that kind of $$$$.
We were even thinking on getting a single axle trailer from craigslist and make a mobile system but then the issue is that you can't really fit always on the back of the restaurants with a truck/camper/trailer.....
Any ideas?
We are sure that someone is out there that made the kit that we need for an affordable price
Please feel free to contact us with your pictures at
wvoram@gmail.com
thanks
August 21, 2011 - 11:29am
#2
Hello Kirk
thanks for the fast reply and the explanation about the water.
We notice that even when filtering with the aquablock fuel filter and the oil looks very clean that every time that we open the the fuel tank we saw the water condensation on the lid.
Now just other few questions.
a) Just heating the oil will get rid of the water? or is heating to certain temp (like 190)and then it needs to be settling for a while?
If so then what will prevent the oil to absorb water again since diesel absorbs the moisture from the air does WVO does the same?
b) We were thinking on adding another fuel tank to the truck on the place where the spare goes and wondering if we collect the wvo there, heating up while driving with the coolant and then filtered to the mail svo tank will that get rid of the water?
c) since water doesn't compress. How the water & methanol kits work?
Thanks again for the info.
Gus
August 21, 2011 - 1:34pm
#3
all really good questions. Kirk?
August 21, 2011 - 3:29pm
#4
You are heating the oil to a temperature that the tiny food particles (with water locked in them) will drop to the bottom and be drained off after settling. I go to about 130*.
I store my oil in 35 gallon sealed containers to avoid humid air.
Water injection cools the air that is taken into the engine. The water is sprayed as a mist and converted to a gas at 212* by the compressed air coming out of the intercooler. Any water will turn to steam before it reaches the combustion chamber, cooling the air and engine since it takes a huge amount of energy. It leaves the engine in the exhaust system.
August 21, 2011 - 5:39pm
#5
You are heating the oil to a temperature that the tiny food particles (with water locked in them) will drop to the bottom and be drained off after settling. I go to about 130*
If you leave your wvo outside in the hot sun for 5 days at 75 or above will that settle things out? oh and only suck off the top and never ever the last 6 inches
August 21, 2011 - 10:34pm
#6
I see 4 choices for fast fueling on the road.
1) leave home with ibc full of clean dry fuel.
2) diesel craft cf in barrel with lid clean 40 or so gallons a night.
3) hot water heater on back of camper for a frybrid still make a lot every night.
Or go collect twice what u need and try to arrange swap allong the way with people that allready have clean oil offer a 2 to 1 swap dirty for clean.
August 21, 2011 - 10:46pm
#7
Forgot one this might be a good use for dana's simple barrel. Fill it heat it go to bed. Pump off top in the am. Would be better than straight out of dumpstet to tank. The savings in fuel filters would pay for it fast. Use a polly barrel and a hand saw to cut the holes. Don't need much in tools to do it.
August 22, 2011 - 1:54pm
#8
Hello Kirk
You are heating the oil to a temperature that the tiny food particles (with water locked in them) will drop to the bottom and be drained off after settling. I go to about 130*.& I store my oil in 35 gallon sealed containers to avoid humid air.
Let's say that we get the other tank under the bed where the spare tire goes. If we get a water heater(1500w 110v). How long should we heat it up and how long should we let it settle for dewatering purposes?
Water injection cools the air that is taken into the engine. The water is sprayed as a mist and converted to a gas at 212* by the compressed air coming out of the intercooler. Any water will turn to steam before it reaches the combustion chamber, cooling the air and engine since it takes a huge amount of energy. It leaves the engine in the exhaust system
I guess that the water in the wvo will not burn or compress even at the high temperatures of the combustion chamber where it supposed to be a mist and that will cause the engine damage?
Thanks
August 22, 2011 - 2:02pm
#9
Mr Miller.
The WVO Guru!!
Thanks for taking your time and getting involved in this thread.
What will be your suggestions for the 1 shot? how about a centrifuge system like the ones that you made with the juicer?
We have no knowledge at all regarding the centrifuge filtration principles and the whole operational system. But if we got something clear is that we are not paying $1300 for one.
Any inputs?
Thanks
August 22, 2011 - 2:10pm
#10
I see 4 choices for fast fueling on the road.
1) leave home with ibc full of clean dry fuel.
We always do that but since every time we leave home we are on the road for like 3 months we can carry that much.
2) diesel craft cf in barrel with lid clean 40 or so gallons a night. & 3) hot water heater on back of camper for a frybrid still make a lot every night.
Or go collect twice what u need and try to arrange swap allong the way with people that allready have clean oil offer a 2 to 1 swap dirty for clean
Those options will imply to have another collection tank and the room is limited. We are considering to mount one where the spare tire goes.
the only concern that we have is the whole weight capacity and the limitation of the truck . We are talking about a 3/4 Ton truck with a 30 gallons of diesel, 50 gallon of wvo, and a 2500lbs slide in Camper. So adding another 50 gallons of wvo may add too much tongue weight. Trust us that we will the weight if we fill up the wvo tank and the water tank of the camper.
So we are trying to figure a good system out.
Thanks
August 22, 2011 - 3:04pm
#11
I think the 1 shot system is a good one. can you build one cheaper?
August 22, 2011 - 3:07pm
#12
If going from straight from bin to tank. Use a small camp stove and cast iron pan pump from close to top and hpt often. Adjust depth often to stay in driest oil. Manifold 2 or 3 spin on or whole house filters 10-2 mic or what's avail. Napa sells 1-12 thread filter heads and large filters. Fill your tank thru the filters then put both pump hoses in the tank and circulate thru filters a few times. Multi passing thru a filter finer than onboard will solve clogging.
Problem these days is most bins get pumped so often usually not much in them above the water and sludge. The on the spot hpt will save a lot of damage that won't show up in the short term.
Even a jeans leg filter in a 15 gal drum would get a lot of junk out if u pumped into that the thru filter into tank.
August 22, 2011 - 7:31pm
#13
Well Mr Miller. We are seriously consider a centrifugal system like the one than you made with the juicer will love so se the blue print and some pics of the modification process of the juicer if you don't mind. I'm a kind of visual learner and as I said before with no clues on the principles and the operational part of how it works. We saw a video of your juicer but only thing that i saw it was "nasty oil in pristine oil out" but i have no clue about how to built it and how does it work. So if you wouldn't mind sharing some wisdom to get us out of our ignorance.
Now another inquire is about mixing the wvo.
We used to run WVO with the nomad kit of GFC for a long time but now we went to the greasecar kit.
Their system used to include a vacuum gauge and it was a good tool to let you know if the filter is going bad or if the wvo is still cold so we are considering on inplementing on our current kit.
We tried mixing the wvo with diesel to improve the viscosity level of the wvo and we also tried this product mixed with the wvo.
http://www.howeslube.com/dieseltreat.php
The vacuum level change drastically as well as the fuel filter life (for better) . And it supposed to eliminate the water.
This product was recommended by a friend that is a truck driver and he said that this is a must on truck driver's on hard winter conditions. He said that the diesel will not gel regardless of the outside temperature and specially since most states don't allow trucks to idle anymore.
Does anyone ever tried anything like this?
Here is the tech specs from the product in case that someone with a degree in chemistry can digest the info and translate that to understandable english for most of us members of the common population.
http://www.howeslube.com/MSDS_Sheets/DieselTreat_MSDS_2009.pdf
Thanks
August 23, 2011 - 7:14am
#14
how to build the centi
http://www.greasecar.com/forums/wvo-filtration/my-new-custom-built-centrifuge-system
August 23, 2011 - 5:09pm
#15
how to build the centi
http://www.greasecar.com/forums/wvo-filtration/my-new-custom-built-centrifuge-system
Thanks for the link.
Now few questions:
a) By sealing the mesh bowl on the juicer where and how the clean oil gets out?
b) do you feed the juicer by gravity flow or using a pump? How to control the oil flow into the juicer to ensure the 10gph?
c) any inputs about http://www.howeslube.com/dieseltreat.php as far as oil viscosity and water eliminator?
August 23, 2011 - 5:12pm
#16
I sealed mine with JB Weld.
The oil gets out by crawling out the top. The crap sticks to the sides since it's heavier.
I use gravity. I have an oil drum with the top sawed off and I have a reducer and a ball valve in the bung of the drum. You control the flow by opening the ball valve to the desired rate. I use less than 10gph as I err on the side of caution.
August 25, 2011 - 1:58pm
#17
My on-board filtration system in the bed of my '69 Chevy C20: Gravity feed from a 18 gal poly (#1) above another 18 gal poly (#2), both in horizontal positions; a SimpleCentriguge bowl is housed in a pressure cooker (lockable lid) and powered by a 1/3 hp AC motor connected to a 2000/4000 inverter; the open bowl system will be used to filter while driving; raw WVO will be poured through a kitchen (50 micron) strainer into #1; a 16 plate FPHE or a temp (140F - 176F) controlled Mega Vegtherm will be used to heat the VO flowing out of a gate valve set to 1/2 gal/min into the CF; CF'd oil will drain into #2; a float switch will light a dash mounted red light when #1 is empty; a 12 VDC Shureflo pump will be plumbed to a solenoid that will divert the VO to either one of two 34 gal aux VO fuel tanks OR recycle the VO again (depending on the amount of junk in the bowl). I've have assembled all the components and will start the conversion of the Perkins diesel engine (turbo 6 cylinder 354 ci mated to a Fuller 10 speed manual tranny) to VO then the on-board filtration system. The entire on-board system will fit forward of a 5th wheel hitch.
August 29, 2011 - 11:42pm
#18
Donb123:
So pretty much you control the flow by looking at it? and assuming based on experience you know the flow rate? I guess it will take us a while to figure it out/ Do you guys heat the oil before to make it go thru the centri?
Rene:
Ot sounds like a very effective system.
Would you mind sharing some pictures? wvoram@gmail.com
thanks
August 30, 2011 - 2:33am
#19
Should be starting the mobile system in Sept. and will attempt to post pics (very computer challenged).
August 30, 2011 - 12:09pm
#20
Just saw this on frybrid forum in the grease bazaar section.
Omega juicer centrifuge for sale $55 includes shipping. Ready to filter
August 30, 2011 - 1:20pm
#21
Yeah, just eyeball. But think of it this way, there is no magical flow rate formula that is going to guarantee your oil is clean. You have variables like the type of oil and it's viscosity ,the amount of particulate suspended in your oil, etc. Just go slow and do some testing and crank it up faster if you feel like that's the thing to do.
I do heat the oil.
September 4, 2011 - 4:50pm
#22
Well thanks again to everyone that is involved in these forum trying to help.
We are more than convinced that the acme as an centrifuge is the way to go.
Unfortunately we can't find them on ebay except a guy that is selling it as a vintage and parts missing and the guy from frybird forum never replied as well.
So anybody will like to sell their acme?????????
If so:
text 813-454-4128
or email: wvoram@gmail.com
regards
Gus
September 4, 2011 - 5:07pm
#23
There's tons of em on ebay. I just won a second one. In fact, do you want it? I got it for $14.40 plus $14.00 s/h? I haven't paid yet and I can forward your contact info to the seller and you can as well?
October 13, 2011 - 12:09pm
#24
thanks to everybody for their input.
We got our juicer and got it ready to clean the oil that we had sitting for a few weeks.
The results were amazing. Very clean oil and we can feel de diference while running. Or may be my impression that the fuel filter had less restriction on the flow and truck ran better.
Now 2 questions.
1) the dirt inside the bowl was nothing near what we saw were posted by Mr Miller. Is that due to how clean was our oil before getting into the Centri?
2) The noise caused by the vibration was driving us nutz!! We place a strap in top that made it quieter for a while but not it seems like it damaged the Centri bearing? Can this be fixed?
Thanks again for all your help.
Thanks
July 2, 2012 - 7:03am
#25
I had no idea the maintenance costs for trucks and campers can run so high, I've never owned a camper but I've always thought that owning one would be really cheap. I guess this is one of those common car myths people always believe without giving it much thought.
July 25, 2012 - 9:18pm
#26
Hello WVO Camper. I see it's been a few months since your last post. I think I learned a lot from reading your thread btw. How's it goin? Have you found a good "on the road" system?
Thanks!
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The reason that you are changing filters so much is probably because the filters are filled up with water. You are not de-watering your oil. The filters catch the free water, the filter media swells, and then you need to change filters. Better to get that water out first, by heating and settling or centrifuging, and then draining the wet oil off the bottom. Water separator filters DO NOT remove suspended water, only free water.
what is suspended water? Well, it is water that is locked up in tiny food particles that is still in your oil, smaller than the micron size of your filter. The only way that you are going to get that water out is by heating and settling or centrifuging, and then filtering.
Water does not compress. When this water gets in the combustion chamber, it will not compress, will explosively turn to steam, and will damage your engine.
For on the road de-watering and filtering, in my opinion, you have 2 choices:
1. Centrifuge
2. Propane heated water heater
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2002 Powerstroke Greasecar kit, 20 plate heat exchanger, water injection, Aeroforce Scan Gauge II, ISSPro fuel pressure, trans temp, boost and EGT gauges, Cyberdyne grease and coolant temperature gauges, auxilliary coolant pump, 282,000 miles, 82,000 on grease.